New member, new project

General motorcycle conversation

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scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Sun Apr 07, 2013 2:19 pm

I have to give a shout out to Pamco Pete. If you guys and gals knew what a great guy he is (and a friggin' electrical genius), you'd all be happy to call him a friend like I do.

Every points bike I have now has a Pamco in it. They all start easy and run great. Pete's customer support is the best in the industry, too.
If he hadn't made this for me, I would have had to dealt with several other ignition issues to get the CB650 running with the CB500 harness. This makes it plug and play.

He mounted the Pamco circuit boards on the 650 plate. Since he used some existing tapped holes, the timing was slightly retarded. We had to file the points plate a little to get it to full advance.

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Again, it's just temporarily installed in these pics. We wanted to make sure it worked properly. I'll route the wires permanently later on.

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Volker_P
Posts: 5508
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:53 am
Location: southern Germany

Re: New member, new project

Postby Volker_P » Tue Apr 09, 2013 2:39 am

scott s wrote:The only oil leak was from this valve cover bolt, and it was a pretty good one. I thought I had all the O-rings and seals on the valve cover....

Have a look here: :wink: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=5815&p=38134

scott s wrote:One thing's for sure: I'm definitely getting oil to the top end!

Oil leaking out is the only sure proof for oil being inside at all! :lol:
Cosky's great (free) online manual: http://cosky0.tripod.com

forum links to common technical issues

If you really like this site and you would not like to see it vanish soon, have a look there: Urgent: Future of HondaCB650.com Forum

scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:49 pm

Odd thing is, that bolt isn't stripped, was torqued properly, and had (has) the washer under it! It now also has an O-ring and isn't leaking. :)

scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:22 pm

The chain finally showed up. I went with a 104 link (stock CB650) and a 40T rear sprocket. If the chain stretches too much over time, I'll have to remove a link. I'm on the second to last mark on the swing arm. The CB650 has a longer swing arm than the 550. It's fine for now and a few more adjustments, though.

That enabled me to adjust the rear brake, get the sprocket cover back on, and change out the charging rotor (now that I can put the engine in gear and hold it with the rear brake).

The 400F pegs do, indeed, work with the 650 shift shaft.
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scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:24 pm

We also worked on mounting the Hall Sensor for the speedometer drive.

My Dad whipped up this neat bracket, and we used longer bolts from the hardware store.
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I used a little silicone as well as the C-clip to attach the magnet to the bracket.
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scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:28 pm

While I replaced the idle mixture screw O-rings, needle jets and float bowl gaskets, Dad fabbed up another simple bracket to mount the pick-up for the sensor.

I found out that the carbs have 102.5 mains in them already, and I think stock is 100. I ground back the tabs on the idle mixture screws and set them at 2.5 turns out, versus 2 1/4, which is what the manual lists. Maybe that's why the carbs sounded so crisp! And no more fuel leaks. Yay!

Anyway, back to the sensor....

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scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Mon Apr 15, 2013 5:56 pm

The speedo works, but I still need to enter the proper tire diameter and change it to MPH.

I also installed a 10K ohm resistor inline on the tach wire to get the signal down.

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That got the tach reading correctly, but it has a little noise in it. The bars would jump up one or two bars over the actual idle speed. We twisted up about 10 feet of wire in my drill to make a homemade capacitor and prove a theory. That took ALL the noise out of the tach signal as made it steady.
I tried wiring in a capacitor from Radio shack, but the smallest one I could fid didn't remove all the noise. I have half a mind to re-attach the coiled wire and just hide it under the tank somewhere.

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kstylian
Posts: 92
Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:56 pm

Re: New member, new project

Postby kstylian » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:09 am

Yes, you'll need a larger capacitor to help filter out EMF noise.

Try an electrolytic radial cap in the range of 1000-10,000uf. Those ceramics are too small in value for this application.

scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:49 am

Now that I've soldered and shrink wrapped all that together, would it hurt it I ran one in series?
Do I splice into the tach wire and run another ground? Or can I splice into the wire that is coming off of that capacitor and going to ground....would that work?

kstylian
Posts: 92
Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:56 pm

Re: New member, new project

Postby kstylian » Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:08 am

I'd just snip it out and re-do. You still have 3 resistors left, correct?

scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:37 am

It's not the resistor I need, is it? I need another capacitor to filter out the noise.

To clarify:
With the tach wire ran directly to the coil, the tach read way too high. I believe it's made for single input. The CB has a wasted spark, 2 signal ignition.

The resistor got the RPM's reading correctly, but there was "noise". This is a bar graph type tach. The actual RPM would be steady, but there would be 2 or 3 bars flicking up and down above actual idle/RPM.

By putting the coiled wire between the resistor and ground, the tach was steady as can be and no "noise". I'm hoping to find the right capacitor to filter out the noise.
Someone suggested to try an electrolytic radial cap in the range of 1000-10,000uf.

kstylian
Posts: 92
Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:56 pm

Re: New member, new project

Postby kstylian » Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:59 am

Correct. Essentially you want to construct a low-pass filter as such:

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Snip out the small ceramic cap and resistor and replace with the circuit above.

Use a larger electrolytic cap (these are polarized) AFTER the resistor. Attach the positive side of the cap to the end of the resistor that feeds the tach. The negative side of the cap goes to ground.

scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:24 am

That's exactly how I have it now. I just need a bigger capacitor. I'll probably wait until the tank is off again and fix it then.

scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:05 pm

Got the seat back from the painter today. Re-mounted the seat pan. I think I might have to come up with a better form of attaching the seat to the frame. Our method works but is a PITA. It's really a 2 man job. Luckily, it only has to come off about once a year for valve adjustments.

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scott s
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:40 am
Location: Rock Hill, SC

Re: New member, new project

Postby scott s » Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:12 pm

While the K&N filters respond well to carb adjustments, they interfere with the side covers. The RH side is worse than the left. I'll have to re-examine this. I could run Uni pods, but I'd rather make these work.

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Speaking of carb adjustments, we were able to tune the Idle Mixture Screws and get rid of 99% of any hesitation, popping, etc. at idle and low speeds, especially once the engine is warm.
I still think it's too lean on the top end. This sucker is STRONG and pulls HARD, but I don't like the way the plugs look. Below is #1 on the left and #4 on the right. Oddly, #1 looked like #4 earlier, before adjusting the IMS. I don't know why it's so clean here...odd.
The bike has 102.5 mains in it (stock is 100). I have an assortment to choose from: 110, 112.5, 115 and 120. I think I'll try the 112.5's next.

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